Assistance Required for Managing Elephant Spam on Black Forest
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Me and my friends often play ranked BF and most of the time we are facing at least two civilizations that use elephants.
Unfortunately, we end up losing in the endgame.
We have tried using a large number of halberds, but even that does not work.
We are wondering if monks are the only practical solution or if there is any other way to defeat these elephant users.
adding to what the other comments say:
by the time the opponents “trample you with elephants”, what are you doing?
as elephants are much more expensive than most other units, they take a lot longer to set up and you need a larger economy to sustain production.
this is basically the core of the games balance: the harder a unit hits, the longer it takes to get to, and the other way round: the weaker a unit, the easier it is to have a lot of them early.
so a more general answer than what the others are saying: if your opponent has a fully upgraded super-lategame unit and you dont, that means you missed your window of opportunity.
if your opponent takes 40 minutes to boom into their lategame elephants, and you take 40 minutes to boom into a weaker unit (basically all units are weaker than elephants), that means your opponent just outplayed you.
you cant “counter” a good lategame (e.
g.
elephants) with a weak lategame (e.
g.
arbalest).
what you can do is attack them *earlier*, because your weaker units take less time to set up, so you can deal damage before their elephants are massed/upgraded.
kind of like in a car race.
you cant “counter” your opponents when theyre already 10 rounds ahead and your tank is empty.
you *could have* played your advantage when they were still in close sight.
rts are all about timing.
not every unit can be beaten at any point of the game, and thats ok because *you cant get* any unit at any point of the game.
Elephants live in the forest.
If you want to hard discourage all melee elephants, have one person (of at least 3?) play Tatars.
Flaming camels are a meme but a deadly one if your opponents can’t stop making elephants.
If they don’t make elephants though, Tatars are suboptimal at Black Forest.
Onagers my friend..
onagers are the key!
If it’s black forest, heavy scorpions are a good bet against mass elephants (pair with halbs).
Because of the chokepoints etc.
and the fact that scorps get bonus vs elephants (+8 for heavy scorp)
Pike-scorp.
Lots of halbs and SO.
Or attack before they can boom into elephant spam.
Someone recommended Halbs and Scorpions on another one of these posts.
I’ve never tried, but in theory, it definitely sounds like it’d be effective.
Pin them in place with Halbs and have like 30+ Scorpions rip through the elephants.
If your civ doesn’t get Elephants, kill them before they get to max pop with fully upgraded Elephants
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Are you multilayering fortified walls at chokes?
Do it, get some siege, some halbs, towers, and force them into a no man’s land of death by way of siege, arrows and spears
Push early it takes along time to create enough eco to support elephantos
Halberdiers are good.
However your mass will die to their mass, especially the first one when the eles are 100% health.
The answer is production.
You need many barracks streaming hundreds of halberdiers at the elephants.
They will gain some ground but eventually lose hp and start to die and you can push them back.
Also they don’t require micro so you can use monks to try to convert the high hp elephants as well.
Don’t just stream them, gather them into little waves and then support with a stream (set the rally point on the barracks right at the battle.) As they start to die rally a bit further back and gather another wave.
You want your halbs to surround an elephant, not the other way around.
You can essentially afford infinite halberdier on BF.
His elephant reinforcements will be slow so eventually you get the upper hand.
Don’t allow them to build forward stables.
And make sure you have your blacksmith upgrades.
Tatars.
Flaming Camels.
You’re welcome
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